SAF will spend big when he feels like theres a player worth paying big money for know what i mean.I think he does want Modric but wont pay over the odds.If we can get him for 30million then i think SAF will go for it.We need him.Also i can see us getting Baines for 10-15million.I dont want Tiote here.I think Powell will come here for around 5million.Kagawa i think is a done deal for around 14million rising to 20million on apperances etc.

HellRaiser20:

you could tell from first looking at him he was average.

Yes, in the first team that was evident but not in the youth set up or reserve matches where his performances fast tracked him into the first team in the first place. The same with other players that built a reputation in the youth set up and reserves such as Richardson Cambell etc. My point is a player is not yet the fully completed player (ability wise) when playing in the reserves and is pushing for 1st team football. It takes a couple of seasons in the first team to really establish yourself or show that you have the ability to play in it. It can work the other way. Who is to say a player that doesn't stand out obviously isn't going to be a success down the road. There is enough evidence of players that supposedly didn't show enough potential creating great careers outside of the club. Again, i reiterate that Pogba is not the finished article by a long shot and its only when he gets to play first team football over a sustained period of time can fans, pundits and whoever can actually judge him on his ability fairly. Anything said now about him; apart from being a player with tremendous potential, is just conjecture.

I think your completely wrong, Maceda was never that skilled fast or anything, you could tell from first looking at him he was average.

i didn't misunderstand your post. You said that he has all these characteristics about Pogba; which are true, but you have only seen them in Reserve/youth games. The proof of the pudding is in top flight football. I seen Maceda in the youth set up and Richardson before him and they were a class above anyone else in games i seen them in. I believed then they were a guarantee to get into the first team as there skill, ability, technique was well above everyone else. Yet when they got into the first team those attributes were matched equally if not more by opposition players. What i'm suggesting is that until Pogba gets first team football for a sustained period of time we can then base our opinions on his true ability and skill. Until that day happens he has great footballing traits with the 'Potential' to progress into a good player. Until that happens everything said about Pogba is just semantics's.

modric is worth 32 million, sure spurs over price players, but for us he could be invaluable , he is classy... the new scholes. im with you on the other 3 though

You seem to have misunderstood my point.

Just because he is moving from the reserves to the premiership does not mean he suddenly becomes slower, weaker, or his technique is worse. His own personal abilities wont change, the players around him will be better but from what we have seen he IS fast enough, he IS agile and strong enough and his technique is good enough, this will not change. The problem with young players usually is not their ability, but how they use it. A big example is Nani, has all the ability to be a world class player, but fails due to his poor understanding of football and the idea of teamwork. He does not seem to understand how the things he does have negative effects on the rest of the team. Jones is also like this, physically hes a tank, lots of energy. HIs understanding of football is what needs to improve, I have seem him play midfield with carrick and his passing was good, so he can pass. You seem to not understand that personal physical abilities do not change, but they are not enough. A footballing mind is the most important aspect of a player. Carrick is a big lad, strong, but hes slow, and he cant turn well but simply because he has a fantastic footballing mind he is our most consistent midfield player and he has been great for us.

HellRaiser20:

Seems a bit illogical. Pogbas agility, strength, and skill will not change due to the opponents, they are his personal skills.

yes it does when your playing in the premier league/champions league which is a step up from the reserves which is a completely logical statement.

HellRaiser20:

Pogba is fast, agily, strong and technically gifted, If he can improve mentally and understand football/his position he will be world class without a doubt.

Your making assertions on something that hasn't happened. It happens a lot on this forum. We assume that a good player in the academy/reserves should therefore be a good player in the first team. first off there is a huge gulf in class, experience and strength between the reserves and the first team is huge. Most players in the reserves don't actually make it into the first team, so you can't be hedging your bets on Pogba to make it seamlessly into the first team. There are a lot of extenuating circumstances that can go against him just as easily go for him. An example of a youth player that was to walk into the first team from the reserves was Macaeda. That was three years ago. And he was the big white hype. Welbeck took a few years to break into the team and had to go on loan for a year on top of this and isn't yet the finished article. Cambell, Shawcross, richardson etc. They were all expected to make it into the team. Making assumptions on a player such as Pogba making the first team is not a guarantee. Along with such an important position it will take him years to prefect his trade in the center of the park. If he does stay at Utd he will be getting brief cameos in the league and if lucky loaned out for most of the season for experience.

I would say rooney has had his prime due to his touch and passing. It has been a really bad year for him, his shooting as been fine but that it is. He has not run around and put the effort in this year, his touch has been terrible sometimes he tries to control a ball and it ends up at the other side of the patch. His passing has been SLOW and off target. He has been a good player, but for 27 million, for a player that I do not expect to play his whole career here, I do not think hes been quite enough. Maybe I expect too much.

About your um, Eden Hazard topic and about ronaldinho.

Kaká (€65M from Milan) - joined in 2009
Cristiano Ronaldo (€96M from Manchester United) - joined in 2009
Karim Benzema (€30M from Lyon) - joined in 2009
Xabi Alonso (€35M from Liverpool) - joined in 2009
Ángel di María (€30M from Benfica) - joined in 2010
Mesut Özil (€12M from Werder Bremen) - joined in 2010
Fábio Coentrão (€30m from Benfica) - joined in 2011


Seems a bit much for 1 league title. Aside for this year we have done better than Real Madrid for the past god knows how many years in CL. They still did poorly this year. your understanding of the importance of a player is scary. Ronaldo is a very good player, but hes not that important, someone will always score goals if you create chances. You think Ronaldo is more important to a team than Alonso? but cost far more than twice as much. Your just trying to buy flash players that are not important, Yaya toure is an important player, he and Kompany won the title for them.

And you say SAF spent a lot of money in the past and he wont now because of money restraints. Well maybe partly true but dont u think maybe due to the history of his expensive players that he learnt his lesson?

Finally to the comment

eddie moroney:

HellRaiser20:

Pogba, very big and strong, lots of energy very agile and great technique.

How can anyone say anything about Pogba until he has played in the first team for 90 minutes in the league. All of those attributes are true but but you don't know to what degree until we see him in a league match and not a reserve game.

Seems a bit illogical. Pogbas agility, strength, and skill will not change due to the opponents, they are his personal skills. His knowledge and understanding of football are what need to improve and be tested. Things like mentality are important and take time for example Evans improved in this area a lot this season, he did not suddenly get faster and suddenly become a better passer. Pogba is fast, agily, strong and technically gifted, If he can improve mentally and understand football/his position he will be world class without a doubt.

HellRaiser20:

Pogba, very big and strong, lots of energy very agile and great technique.

How can anyone say anything about Pogba until he has played in the first team for 90 minutes in the league. All of those attributes are true but but you don't know to what degree until we see him in a league match and not a reserve game.

S07C:

Hazard is a top top talent and we missed out on him. Just like we did with Ronaldinho who went on to be the World Player of the Year twice or so but we did get C Ronaldo and he was phenomenal for us but what are the odds that we're gonna find similar caliber player that matches Hazard? Anyways, Kagawa will be a great player for us if he does come but to expect miracles from just 1 player would be being absolutely naive. I don't understand with what Fergie means with no value in the market. So paying over the odds for Ferdinand, Rooney, Berbatov, Veron was all justifiable a decade ago? I like it how we splurged then and you didn't see other teams complain about how we inflated the market then. This was bound to happen. As the years pass by, a 17 to 18 year old Rooney who was bought for 27M is worth probably the same as Hazard or even more more in today's market. So just because Hazard didn't pick us doesn't make him a bad player at all. He'll be a great player no doubt and Chelsea are lucky to have him just like we were when we had Rooney and Ronaldo. No offense to Giggsy and Scholesy but depending on them to do the job every time especially in the big games is asking too much. Recalling Scholesy back instead of investing in a great midfielder last year and this year just shows how desperate we were/are. We lost a top top talent in Pogba to Juve for NOTHING. He'll probably be one of the quality players in the world in a few years time. It's simple as that if you splurge on one or two quality players and groom some of the youths in the first team, it would work wonders. Barcelona does that, why can't we?

SAF will spend big if he thinks it right, we can't afford to waste money, any big money signing simply has to be world class that's why I would spend big on Modric, not many others would I pay such a fee for though. Hazard is a big loss and I won't pretend otherwise however Kagawa is a very worthy replacement, he is world class as you will see when he finally does sign for us. We have plenty of options to sign don't think for a second that we do not, in fact we have not had so many potential ins for as long as I can remeber.

Also don't worry about losing Pogba because his career is officially over, whatever he could have been has gone down the tube he will regret this move for the rest of his career trust me that, Juventus' midfield leaves little room for movement and transfers will continue into that position, Pogba will not play more than 20 games for Juve I would guess, the fact that they are to loan him out already should echo bells through his ears that he will never make it there yet his stupidity will prevent him from doing the right thing, even if he were not to stay at Utd he should try his hardest to find a new club, though this is all hypothetical as he has clearly decided to leave.

when players dont want to go to United there is normally a reason and if it is a choose against any team other than RM OR BARC then it is simply for MONEY. We missed out on Hazard, but there will be a reason, something will happen in the next few months and people will say thank God he didnt come here. As soon as Hazard said that it would take him 10 days to make an decision then to be honest 'GO SOME WHERE ELSE' and he did. United will invest this year my not stupidly, i believe SAF will invest as always in Youth with some experience.

Hazard is a top top talent and we missed out on him. Just like we did with Ronaldinho who went on to be the World Player of the Year twice or so but we did get C Ronaldo and he was phenomenal for us but what are the odds that we're gonna find similar caliber player that matches Hazard? Anyways, Kagawa will be a great player for us if he does come but to expect miracles from just 1 player would be being absolutely naive. I don't understand with what Fergie means with no value in the market. So paying over the odds for Ferdinand, Rooney, Berbatov, Veron was all justifiable a decade ago? I like it how we splurged then and you didn't see other teams complain about how we inflated the market then. This was bound to happen. As the years pass by, a 17 to 18 year old Rooney who was bought for 27M is worth probably the same as Hazard or even more more in today's market. So just because Hazard didn't pick us doesn't make him a bad player at all. He'll be a great player no doubt and Chelsea are lucky to have him just like we were when we had Rooney and Ronaldo. No offense to Giggsy and Scholesy but depending on them to do the job every time especially in the big games is asking too much. Recalling Scholesy back instead of investing in a great midfielder last year and this year just shows how desperate we were/are. We lost a top top talent in Pogba to Juve for NOTHING. He'll probably be one of the quality players in the world in a few years time. It's simple as that if you splurge on one or two quality players and groom some of the youths in the first team, it would work wonders. Barcelona does that, why can't we?

Tiote is too slow, modern football needs a more agile player. For example Yaya toure is very agyle and a very good looking player Pogba, very big and strong, lots of energy very agile and great technique.

HellRaiser20:

If this season is anything to go by, his peak has been and gone.

That doesn't make any sense, aside from the fact that last season Rooney scored 35 goals, suggests his peak has NOT "been and gone", but even if it did then Ferdinand's peak has been and gone and yet you say he has had a successful carreer but Rooney has not?

Did Rooney not work out? I agree with you on Hulk, personally I think he will be a failure in the EPL, and despite his ability £40m was certainly too much for Hazard, I completely disagree on Tiote, he is a fantastic dm, I would take him for about £17m. You wouldn't pay £32m for Modric? I certainly would, don't expect him to go for any less than that, he's an established world class cm of course he will cost a lot. There is always a chance of a player becoming a flop but I see no reason why this would apply to Modric. Yes it's a risk to spend big but sometimes you have to do it and SAF was clearly prepared to pay big for Hazard so why not spend the money on Modric?

I don't agree with the idea that great players can't be bought cheap (Kagawa is a testament to that) but sometimes there are positions needed that offer no viable cheaper options, I think this is such a case, perhaps Dembele would be a good buy but he would not be world class which is what so many of the fans pine for, if we were to get both Modric and Kagawa (I admit it's a big if) we would have 2 more world class players in our squad. I have heard nothing from you on the subject of Nick Powell, £5m for a League 2 (1) player, now that's a rip off.

Also Ronaldo and Valencia were bought for similar fees to that which Tiote would cost (apparently) so for £17m I would definately take Tiote maybe even £18m.